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yes i see now what you mean by not completely symetrical, in the middle, the three orbs ARE the same correct? just flipped and turned? and i accept your challenge you see i do a lot of drawing on paper which are light hearted it's just that i never put them on computer because it takes away from the natural flow of it. like i drew this one pic based offa' "Lucy in The Sky with Diamonds" by the Beatles and it turned out so peaceful! i want to see something from you as well, i want to see a logo, it doesn't matter for what it just has to look as professional as possible and very clean as well as being creative and eye catchy. i think it will be good practice to do something outside of a comfort zone. oh and what is paintNET? i use paintshop